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  HATCHER OF DEATH
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:51 am Reply with quote

Hi. I have a GQF hatcher and incubator. At first the chicks were hatching in the hatcher as normal. My last few batches have gone from being alive in the incubator to being dead in the hatcher. Temp is regulated along with water. I did disinfect but am wondering what the heck is going on. Ventilation holes are wide open. Too wide??? My last 2 chicks have hatched in the incubator. I just have to watch since the incubator is still rotating other eggs. I only have 4 eggs left to hatch, so I have put my hatcher up for the year and am relying on my incubator. I realize the chicks are not in postition, but at least they are still alive. Please tell me what I am doing wrong and get me under control. I get rather upset when a chick is fully formed and doesn't hatch. What a waste Sad Thanks everyone for replying in advance.
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bcraft



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 335
Location: Ohio
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:53 pm Reply with quote

Did the trouble start after you disinfect? I also use GQF. I place a humidity & temperature monitor on the trays. You will find all tray are not the same with these hatchers.
My guess your humidity is to low,or the temperature to high. Double check with a new monitor. I got one that monitor humidity & temp. keep daily high and low of both. Made my acurite at wal-mart for less than 10.00



Burt
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:21 pm Reply with quote

Thanks for the suggestions. My question is what should the humidity be? I've kept the temperature on the tray where they were to hatch at 98 to 99. I have 2 thermometers in hatcher and top tray is lower in temperature, but tray with eggs higher. I tried to get temp to 99.5 but it won't go that high? Asked someone and they said I was cooking babies and to turn temp down, although when I opened the eggs up after they didn't hatch, the little guys look in perfect condition, just DEAD. Shocked I'm getting discouraged and don't want to be known as a peachick killer. Any more specific information would be greatly appreciated. I have 4 eggs left : Confused
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bcraft



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 335
Location: Ohio
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:06 pm Reply with quote

You are right on with temp of 99.5. The humidity should be 60% in the incubator. Run my hatcher at 65% raise the humidity by adding another water pan. Opening the vents will lower it, but I like running mine wide open in both the incubator,and hatcher.

I like the monitor,because I can check what the daily high & low were for both.

If you are not going over 100. Then you are not cooking them.

I also lay my eggs flat and manual turn them,plus use the auto turner.
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burdgurl
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Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 384
Location: USA
PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 7:26 am Reply with quote

Soggy,

I'm having the same darn problem , it's frustrating as heck! Everything's clean, disinfected, etc. , keep close check on the temp. and humidity at all times with a wick, dry bulb reading AND a digitial therm./hygrometer, I have done all I know to do .
Chicks are alive and wiggling in those eggs up to about day 27 then I detect no movement for they are dying late on day 27 or sometime on day 28. Have hatched a few but only about 30% of eggs set and have almost the identical situation as what you have explained. The ones that have hatched, hatched vigorously on day 26 .


I have a question for all you seasoned breeders out there. Here on this forum I am seeing to raise the humidity in the hatcher anywhere from 65-95% ?!! ( can this not drown the chicks?)
Yet, if Soggy and I are having them hatch in the incubator at the 60%, why bother to raise it at all in the hatcher ?

The few I have hatched in the hatcher were doing so at around 77% humidity but only a small percentage of all eggs in the batch at that time.
I also have to keep the vent holes closed about 1/2 way to achieve that high of humidity, this with 2-3 pans of water in the hatcher ! ( GQF hatcher separate from my GQF Incubator)
So, I am opening the door to the hatcher a few times a day for about a minute -at the most at a time- to allow additional fresh air exchange. Could opening the door somehow be a problem?
Seems I read somewhere if you open the door at the wrong time it could cause the chicks to die in the shell, how's one to know THAT magic moment?

I have a few left to hatch on/about this Friday and if at all possible I would love to be able to get 100% hatch out of those , please help !
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bcraft



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 335
Location: Ohio
PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 3:18 pm Reply with quote

I had some of the same trouble with the GQF incubators. Fine for most eggs ,but for peafowl eggs lay the eggs flat and manual turn the eggs every 12 hrs. also use the auto turner.

Water surface more to raise the humidity. I use 3 pans in the hatcher. vents open for fresh air. If need to I have place water pans in the incubator room,to get the humidity up.

This year used hens to set the eggs for a week before putting them in the incubator much better hatch.


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Burt........NO I dont know where Ernie is.
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 8:51 am Reply with quote

Hi everyone. I have officialy put my hatcher away for the rest of the year. I have hatched 4 out of 4 babies in the incubator in the last week. I'm sure this isn't the proper way, but I let them keep rotating as I have a few eggs left not ready to hatch. I watch for peeping through the egg and then I do surgery and get them out. I have had all 4 babies this way and all are doing great Laughing As far as the eggs not forming, any egg that was fertile has continued to develop in my incubator. The incubator is absolutely wonderful. The hatcher is a death hole Twisted Evil I guess I'll have to really investigate the hatcher before next season. I have 2 eggs left that are developing nicely and should hatch Friday. (Or should I say have surgery done on them when they start to peep). I know this isn't right, but at least they are alive. Shocked Well, that's my big experience with the hatcher. Thanks for all your ideas.
Soggybottom
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burdgurl
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Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 384
Location: USA
PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:14 pm Reply with quote

Soggy,

I'm following your lead and think I will wait until I see these last eggs pip out in the bator and only after that will I put them in the hatcher .
Glad to hear your 4 outta 4 hatched but did you add some more eggs? Thought those were to be your last 4 ? Wink

Not sure why you are having to perform surgery on them though Question Always heard it's best to let them do the work on their own, that necessary in order for them to draw that yolk sac in properly.


bc,
Not sure about Soggy but, my eggs are incubated horizontally, I have been religiously given them extra hand turns through 180 degrees 2 x a day-in opposite directions each time- in addition to the auto turning provided by the bator.
I think taking the eggs from the hen's after the first week gives them a great jump start but surely the LATE DIS problems do not benefit much from doing this, do they ?!
Please don't misunderstand, I 've read many of your posts and a great help you are to folks, am just trying to reason this all out.

Another thought -per my situation is-I have a high velocity fan in the incubator but a standard fan in the hatcher, perhaps I should swith to a high velocity fan in the hatcher. These are the older style models, 1226's from back in the 90's but both are in fine working condition.

I have come to the conclusion ( in my case ) it could be one of two-or both things. Either too much humidity in the hatcher and/or not enough air flow in the hatcher , even though I open that door briefly many times a day for added fresh air. I also do have good air flow , ventilation etc. in the room where these machines are located.

I still would love to hear what relative humidity more of you are actually using in those hatchers ? I have heard anywhere from 65-95%, this is confusing to say the least.
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:38 am Reply with quote

burdgirl,
I had 2 eggs hatch in the incubator and 4 were left. 2 of these 4 have now hatched and I have 2 lonely eggs left to hatch on Friday. I'm sure that taking the chicks out of the egg is really bad, but I'm afraid that since they have been turning and are in the incubator vertically, (I have them in egg crates with holes in the bottom), that the babies might not be pipping in their air sac. I've found that once they start to pip, and I begin opening the egg where they pipped, they start to kick and really want out. I leave the chick attatched to the sack in the egg and put them in a pan with a towel at the bottom of the incubator. After a few hours they have broken the cord on their own and are running around. I know that this isn't the right way to hatch eggs, but unfortunately it seems to be the only way that I am getting any live babies right now. With only 2 left, I'm not going to change. Next year I need to do some major testing on chickens or something to get that hatcher right. I would love for them to hatch the right way, but have lost most of my babies when I tried the hatcher. I don't rotate the eggs any more than the incubator does and try not to open the door that much. I must say that every egg that I placed in the incubator that was fertile fully developed this year, at least until the day I put it into the HATCHER OF DEATH! Twisted Evil

Good luck burdgirl!
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bcraft



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
Posts: 335
Location: Ohio
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:08 am Reply with quote

burdgurl

Yes putting the eggs under a broody hen for a week. Helps the problem with the chicks DIS.
This is the first time I used the setting hens. My first batch all of the fertile eggs hatched. 100%.
Dont understand why it works. Got the info from some of the top breeders.

My problem was lossing a few the last few days, much better hatch with the hens.

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Burt........NO I dont know where Ernie is.
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DMFarms
Site Admin


Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Posts: 183
Location: Winona Texas
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:34 pm Reply with quote

Peafowl eggs are hard to hatch full term in a incubator. The first week of incubation is the most critical time of incubation it hard to do in a incubator that why we set them under chickens for a week. If a chick don't get off to a good start then it is weak when it time to hatch and most of the time it will die before it pips or will die before it pips completely out. We have a 95% hatch rate doing it this way. We run around 45 to 50% humidity in the incubator and hatcher. We set a few eggs full term in the incubator at the end of breeding season to see if they would hatch only one hatched without help three piped but I had to help out of the egg and the rest died without pipping. This is the same incubators we use ever year it will hatch 95% of the fertial eggs under a chickens for a week and 5% if put straight in the incubator
Doug
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burdgurl
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Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 384
Location: USA
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:40 am Reply with quote

DMFarms, thank you for the further information, all you guys have been of great help.
I guess, like with people, getting through that first trimester is of ultimate importance.

Soggy, good luck with your remaining eggs to hatch, I hope they do well for you !!
My 4 are in the hatcher now. 3 have externally pipped, one I think is a dud. Sad

One egg externally pipped early yesterday a.m. and now it's membrane is drying out, gotta go work on that one.
I plan on wetting the membrane down some with my finger and then putting a wet gauze over the hole in the egg. I have raise the humidity in the hatcher to 71 % If anyone has any further suggestions please let me know what to do as soon as you can !
Gosh I'll be sooo glad when these last eggs are done .

Thanks again !
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:02 am Reply with quote

burdgirl,
If i were you, I WOULD GET THOSE CHICKS OUT!!!! They definately should have hatched by now if they were going to. Once they've pipped and nothing else happens for a few hours, I go in and get the babies out. Pull them out but leave the cord attatched to the egg and let them dry out. Leave them in the incubator until they are nice and dry. I know this isn't the right way, but the only way that I've had any babies alive lately. The way I see it is if they've pipped, they are 99% ready to exit the egg anyway. I hope everything works out with them. I know how frustrating it is to watch and wait for a whole month only to have dead chicks. GOOD LUCK!!!!! Shocked
SOGGY
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burdgurl
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Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 384
Location: USA
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:28 pm Reply with quote

Hi Soggy,

Thanks for you continued well taken advice but
oh no, once the chicks have made the external pip I never help them out , I never help them out even before that point. They have air once they've done the exernal pip - and the nice warm humid hatcher - so, I leave the rest up to them. That work they gotta do in that egg is necessary for them to absorb that yolk sac.
I've always heard if they cannot make it on their own then they prob. would end up with problems later on. ( not strong good chicks to begin with ) The one chick I did put the wet gauze on is out now as of 4:00 and doing great ! Very Happy

How's it going with yours? I wish you so much luck with them , please let us know !
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soggybottom



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 31
Location: Mayville, NY
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:34 pm Reply with quote

burdgirl,
I'm so glad that you have the patience to let those babies do what they need to do. I do not. I'm so afraid that they are going to die in those eggs that it makes me sick. I'm sure that the chicks I have hatched so far would have made it out on their own, but I can't leave them alone, especially since they are standing vertical and not in a hatcher. I must admit that I am a complete amature to this whole thing. Last year I decided I wanted to raise peacocks. I bought some eggs through the mail and had a cheap styraphone incubator. I turned them faithfully and used a lightbulb to try and candle them. I had no idea what I was looking for so I left them all in just in case one was alive. Finally Chloe arrived, my first and only peachick. She was so lovely, until the dog ate her at age 2 weeks. I was crushed so I tried again with the eggs. This time all 12 were dead after I waited 30 days and watched them so closely for movement. It was heart breaking. This year I got the good incubator and hatcher and was really excited. My eggs weren't very fertile at first and I had to throw alot of them away. Then the eggs started to develop and I was excited. I only had 4 hens laying and the eggs were coming to me spiraticaly, but I was getting most in the incubator. Then, my first eggs were alive before they went to the hatcher, and dead when they came out. This happened time and time again until peewee started to peck in the incubator (she was quite early). She hatched in the incubator and is doing well. I had 2 more die in hatcher before I realized that I had to keep them in the incubator. By this time I'm pretty discouraged. That's why when I see a chick pip in the incubator my excitement level rises and I have no patience. I know this is bad, but I can't stand waiting and wondering if they are dying in that egg. Well, I should know tomorrow if my last 2 will hatch and I have all winter to figure out what I am doing wrong and how to correct it. Embarassed
I'm so glad one of your chicks has arrived and best of luck with the others.
Wink Soggy
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